115,000 to 200,000 Deaths: Did 1917-1923 Pogroms Create the 'Proto-Shoah'?
Between 1917 and 1923, antisemitic violence swept Eastern Europe, allegedly killing between 115,000 and 200,000 Jews, a pattern one participant labels the 'proto-Shoah.' The violence was characterized by massacres, including instances at places of worship and the lynching of community leaders.
The core argument centers on whether these pogroms provided the necessary ideological cover and normalized the scale of anti-Jewish violence for the Nazis. Some participants argue the violence by 'petty bourgeois goyim' mirrors fascist motives, while others claim the Soviet actions were anomalous to the pattern of hatred. There is a palpable debate over establishing a direct causal line from the 1917-1923 events to the Holocaust, even while acknowledging ideological echoes like 'Judeo-Bolshevism.'
Opinion suggests the pogroms were a critical precursor to Axis actions. Consensus weights the normalization of mass murder during this period as significant, even if the direct physical linkage to the Shoah remains highly contested. The dispute boils down to historical inevitability versus ideological contamination.
Key Points
#1The pogroms established a precedent for mass violence.
The author suggests the normalization of mass murder during 1917-1923 served as a clear precursor for later Nazi actions, regardless of direct evidence.
#2Anti-Jewish hatred utilized specific, recurring tropes.
Commenters noted the adoption of tropes like branding Jews as 'Christ-killers' or linking them to 'Judeo-Bolshevism' during the violence.
#3The violence's immediate nature involved self-enrichment.
One user observed that the violence was initially driven by 'petty bourgeois goyim' looking to despoil Jews, drawing parallels to Fascist behavior.
#4The link to the Holocaust is debated.
Opposing views actively question whether the pogroms are the sole 'origin event' for the Shoah, despite acknowledging thematic links.
#5Jewish economic activity had cultural roots.
An outlier observation pointed out that Jewish microbusinesses often existed due to religious necessity (Shabbat adherence), a factor analysts frequently ignore in economic readings.
Source Discussions (4)
This report was synthesized from the following Lemmy discussions, ranked by community score.